Saturday, January 22, 2011

Enemies Of The State (Of Glennsanity)

Via Digby it looks like the groundwork is being done to create another one of those "coincidences" involving right-wing rhetoric and violence, this time over an obscure CUNY professor who co-authored some papers on poverty 45 years ago who is now getting death threats thanks to some unwelcome attention from one Glenn Beck.

Frances Fox Piven, a City University of New York professor, has been a primary character in Mr. Beck’s warnings about a progressive take-down of America. Ms. Piven, Mr. Beck says, is responsible for a plan to “intentionally collapse our economic system.”

Her name has become a kind of shorthand for “enemy” on Mr. Beck’s Fox News Channel program, which is watched by more than 2 million people, and on one of his Web sites, The Blaze. This week, Mr. Beck suggested on television that she was an enemy of the Constitution.

Never mind that Ms. Piven’s radical plan to help poor people was published 45 years ago, when Mr. Beck was a toddler. Anonymous visitors to his Web site have called for her death, and some, she said, have contacted her directly via e-mail. 

When a liberal non-profit group asked Fox News to maybe tone it down a smidge, Fox News replied that it had no reason to because Glenn Beck "denounces violence".

So if anything happens to the 78-year old professor that maybe .001% of America had ever even heard of before Glenn Beck targeted her, if any of Glenn Beck's more deranged followers actually does decide that Beck's right and that she's an enemy of America for something she said 45 years ago, it'll be just another unfortunate coincidence, we'll be told.

And Beck will move on to demonizing his next "enemy of the state" while saying he denounces violence.  Meanwhile, I see my new best friends have quite the enlightened viewpoint on the whole deal:

Um. She IS an enemy of the constitution. She’s an enemy of capitalism. She’s an enemy of free speech. If she thinks that the actions of others, ie: nasty e-mails, threats, comments on a blog, translate into silencing someone talking truthfully about her work, then I do believe Piven is ironically giving Beck a circular validation of his claims.

Nice guys.  A person's opinion makes them an enemy of free speech.  If we could harness the irony in that statement, we might have enough to manufacture a new sun or three.

With all due respect… drop dead , lady. You’re a monster not a healer. Helping poor people by recklessly and intentionally gerrymandering a system that would result in the wholesale destruction of the world’s economy should, in my view, put you on the Olbermann World’s Worst List. (What?… fired?  bwaha)

Free speech apparently means "In America we can say whatever we want that might terrorize a senior citizen and could possibly lead to someone taking death threats seriously against somebody for having an opinion we don't like from two generations ago, so don't you dare try to silence us!"  Oh yeah, and Olbermann was fired and "silenced" so let's have a good laugh.  Champions of free speech, our friends.

Never mind the fact that a 78 year old woman is now getting death threats thanks to macaroon on FOX News.

16 comments:

Zandar's Credibility Problem said...

Picking a fight with IOTW again after they destroyed you last time? My goodness, you really are taking this Olbermouth thing hard.

Once again I have to say this is reckless action taken by somebody who isn't in their right mind and I have to wonder if you won't snap and become the next Loughner. I'm not the only one who's noticed you have a very, very unhealthy obsessive hatred for Glenn Beck.

I wonder, will you take President Obama seriously and "bring a gun" next time a conservative blog gives you a good fisking?

Zandar's Credibility Problem said...

Attention IOTW readers, here's some more facts about this Zandar idiot:

Did you know that Zandar is a fraud?

He created a commenter named Arcadian as a sock puppet and used the account for months until he got busted.

When real conservative commenters destroy his terrible arguments he panics and he locks his threads so he gets the last word in.

When conservative blogs call him out and PROVE he's nothing more than an ignorant fool, a gullible hack and a race-bating idiot he runs for the hills.

Zandar is a proven liar, fraud, and fool. He will lie to you and try to fool you again because he thinks you're the "Stupid" he's fighting against.

Why are you wasting time on this blog? Don't feed his ego. If you leave, he'll shut this travesty of a blog down. Help this poor, deluded man.

Before he lies to you again. He's pathological.

Oh No!

SteveAR said...

Free speech apparently means "In America we can say whatever we want that might terrorize a senior citizen and could possibly lead to someone taking death threats seriously against somebody for having an opinion we don't like from two generations ago, so don't you dare try to silence us!"

Zandar's lying again. Another drink. Good thing I got sleep last night.

The part you did get right was that what your "new best friends" said is free speech. That's what free speech is.

Far from being an opinion from two generations ago, Obamacare is very much something that would fall under Cloward-Piven. It's a lot more recent than you let on.

Beck is right, just like your new BFFs; Piven is an enemy of the Constitution. You don't like conservatives saying these things; but I notice you still haven't said anything but one sentence in a comment regarding all the recent hate speech from Rep. Steve Cohen, although you claim you disagreed with what he said. I have to wonder if that's really true; your lack of interest in civility on your side indicates you wouldn't say Cohen's words or those of any other Democrat would could potentially lead to violence, even if you believed they could. Like a true hypocrite, you would have the federal government violate the free speech rights of conservatives while your side can say whatever the hell it wants, and it has.

Ironically, you engage in much the same rhetoric. But you'll never admit it.

Never mind the fact that a 78 year old woman is now getting death threats thanks to macaroon on FOX News.

Monsters get old, too. Just because they get old doesn't mean they aren't monsters.

Zandar's Credibility Problem said...

Piven's plan to destabilize the country by destroying the country's health insurance providers is part and parcel of Obamacare. There will be no private insurance companies by 2020 in America. They will have been driven out of business along with thousands of doctors. Reducing America to a third world hell hole where even Mexico would have better health care has been the plan of Obamacare all along.

Yes, Frances Fox Piven is an enemy of the state. There's no other way to see her plan other than domestic terrorism. She should be in prison right now with Bill Ayers.

Oh, and Zandar, would you like to comment on how your blog was the source of inspiration for the assassination attempt on Gov. Jay Nixon (R-Missouri)?

Maybe you should be in prison too.

SteveAR said...

So if anything happens to the 78-year old professor that maybe .001% of America had ever even heard of before Glenn Beck targeted her, if any of Glenn Beck's more deranged followers actually does decide that Beck's right and that she's an enemy of America for something she said 45 years ago, it'll be just another unfortunate coincidence, we'll be told.

Right. Just like the murders of seven babies, an unfortunate women, and thousands of other human fetuses at an abortion mill (that's on top of the Stalin-esque numbers of aborted "choices", around 35 million) is nothing more than an unfortunate coincidence of what pro-abortion zealots have said for decades.

Remember that Jared Loughner exhibited much of the same tendencies and hatreds as liberals. Remember also that it was one of Loughner's fellow Tuscon residents who said on Kos' site that Gabrielle Giffords was dead to the resident. And that Moulitsas himself targeted Giffords district with a figurative "bulls eye" (words as opposed to a picture). For all we know, Loughner could very well have taken those posts on Kos to heart. I'm sure you'll tell us there's no way this was possible, although we really don't know for sure if it wasn't an influence. Just sayin'.

ZCP, Jay Nixon is a Democrat. But the story you linked to contains a lot of information about what is a lefty nutjob who decided to murder a middle-of-the-road Democrat, including how the media have ignored it. Zandar, maybe there should be a discussion of knife control, right?

Zandar's Credibility Problem said...

Hey, Zandar's made that mistake before too.

And I'm more worried about how that liberal nutjob and the liberal media who covered up for them are ignoring how hate merchants like Zandar inspire assassination attempts on politicians.

Zandar's Credibility Problem said...

Obama talks about guns and knives, people try to kill Democrats with guns and knives.

Why does Obama hate Democrats so much, I wonder?

Anonymous said...

Yeah, I guess I'll break the thread, as infested as it is. Why not - It's a quiet Saturday.

I have no idea why conservatives have been given any special rights to choose who is an enemy of the Constitution; I didn't vote for that, and it certainly isn't like they have this track record of being correct about anything. They have an incredible track record of screaming and crying about anything they don't like, which sort of wears the rest of us down, like the latest iteration of a toddler in the waves of a public tantrum.

But, calling Piven an enemy of the Constitution is just patently silly. I mean, sure, you can say it - calling for the imprisonment/punishment of people for their opinions? Pretty dubious legally, but par the the course in RightThink. It's the latest 2 minutes of hate, and it makes them happy, I suppose.

Getting death threats isn't even unusual anymore for anyone deemed doubleplusungood by the Right. I've seen too many 'Liberal Hunting Licenses' and 'Liberal.Rope.Tree. Some Assembly Required' references to be surprised by the free speech out of the Right any more. Maybe the right doesn't even think it's unusual to call for someone's death anymore.

Or, for that matter, causal crowing about how 'they outnumber us' and 'it's their country' - as if we don't belong here. Wasn't that what you said, Problem?

I know that Beck's only calling for killing 'radicals' but I'm pretty sure Beck doesn't have that sort of authority. And, neither do you, or me for that matter. Doesn't seem to ever stop, though. Even when people run into liberal churches and start shooting, or try to bomb parades, or attack abortion clinics, or gay bars, harass people on the street, or call in death threats, never stops.

It's enough for a guy to not enjoy his weekend after all. Almost.

Zandar's Credibility Problem said...

"Or, for that matter, causal crowing about how 'they outnumber us' and 'it's their country' - as if we don't belong here. Wasn't that what you said, Problem?"

If that's what the vote of the people says, then we expect you to abide by it. Of course, liberals have been ignoring that since Bush v. Gore made it clear to you.

If you think the economy in 2012 is going to be good enough for the Democrats to gain seats in Congress and keep the White House, you're mad.

Zandar's Credibility Problem said...

And nobody has yet decided to answer my questions: what level of responsibility does Zandar's hateful rhetoric have in the attempt on Jay Nixon's life, and why isn't Piven an enemy of America and should be treated like one?

Anonymous said...

"If that's what the vote of the people says, then we expect you to abide by it. Of course, liberals have been ignoring that since Bush v. Gore made it clear to you."

So, when the vote of the people ended GOP rule of House and Senate in 2006 and elected by overwhelming numbers Obama in 08, how precisely did you abide by it? Because I saw a lot of asshats on street corners call for Obama's dismissal as being a Manchurian Candidate of some sort. I also remember a sizable portion of those same asshats discussing 'secession' when they didn't win, especially when HCR passed. I don't remember people on the left claiming that the GOP win was illegitimate, but I did hear that from conservatives on the street in 06 and 08. How times change.

It's fascinating that it's OK for conservatives to rally and protest, but not liberals. Add to this the right's general interest in calling for the death or imprisonment of people because they just didn't like something they did or said, or just ARE, and we come full circle to the left's main complaint - the right wing simply does not want any form of reconciliation or discussion with the rest of the nation.

So, here's my counter question: If Zandar has any level of responsibility for his 'hateful rhetoric', then you must also accept your own share, yes? So, I think that, being a generally aggressive asshat who has largely declared that his entire purpose on this site is to drive it from the Blogosphere by ranting at it until Zandar shuts it down, what punishment will you accept for being such a colossal ass? And, as a follow up, what sort of authority do you possess to pass such judgment on anyone, Piven, Zandar or anyone else?

My answer would be: 'none'. Well, actually it's 'up yours', but the POLITE answer is 'none'.

SteveAR said...

So if anything happens to the 78-year old professor that maybe .001% of America had ever even heard of before Glenn Beck targeted her, if any of Glenn Beck's more deranged followers actually does decide that Beck's right and that she's an enemy of America for something she said 45 years ago, it'll be just another unfortunate coincidence, we'll be told.

Take a drink. Zandar is lying again.

How about Piven saying that violence is ok if it is part of the left's strategy a little more than six years ago? How about Piven calling for riots, as she did less than a month ago:

An effective movement of the unemployed will have to look something like the strikes and riots that have spread across Greece in response to the austerity measures forced on the Greek government by the European Union, or like the student protests that recently spread with lightning speed across England in response to the prospect of greatly increased school fees.

This garbage was written by a 78-year old monster and enemy of the Constitution.

But the liberals deliberately don't mention it. Because it takes away from the "narrative". For the Left, only Glenn Beck and conservatives create violent rhetoric. For the Left, truly vile and violent rhetoric from their own side doesn't exist. But the violent rhetoric from the Left does exist and there is proof of it.

Anonymous said...

If you can posit that Piven, an academic I and maybe 90% of anyone else had never heard of, is an enemy of the Constitution, and thus shot/imprisoned for her statements, then I can call for the death/imprisonment of much of the talking heads on Fox and talk radio, who have much wider audiences that take them very very seriously, as enemies of the Constitution for taking authority they don't actually possess and demanding action they will refuse to admit culpability for if it does happen.

SteveAR said...

If you can posit that Piven, an academic I and maybe 90% of anyone else had never heard of, is an enemy of the Constitution, and thus shot/imprisoned for her statements,...

First, I don't believe that you don't know who Piven is. But if you truly don't, then what the hell are you doing talking about subjects you have no knowledge of?

Second, who among Beck, the guys at I Own The World, me, or ZCP have said Piven should actually be shot? Even in the previous idiotic attempt by Zandar to say Beck said people should be shot, I proved that Beck was using a metaphor. And only ZCP has said she should go to prison, and only as a counter to your ridiculous, continuous claims that Palin, Beck, and conservatives had anything to do with what happened in Tuscon.

The problem is you just don't like tough talk from conservatives and would try to take away our free speech rights, while you are extremely approving of similar talk from your fellow leftists. You're a hypocrite.

Anonymous said...

First off, that happens to be true - contrary to what you may believe, I don't spend my free time posting at blogs and reading every paper published anywhere by people you imagine to be my heroes. And considering that the right has deemed creationists and Climate change deniers a seat at the policy table, the charge that 'why the hell am I talking about subjects I have no knowledge of' is just precious. Glenn Beck has no background in anything besides being a media personality, and yet he's free to talk about stupid all the time, don't see you worried about that.

Second, Glenn Beck is saying precisely that - shoot them in the head. You said he meant 'radicals' which is a really vague statement, because his definition of 'radical' seems to be anyone he is calling radical, which has included a lot of liberals, and what a surprise that is. If you can call that a metaphor, you can call pretty much anything a metaphor. Beck said something inflammatory, like he does on every show, and we're supposed to accept his cherubic grin and smarmy style with the wink and a nod.

Finally, you don't seem to like liberal tough talk as much as I don't like yours, so back at you, pal. Of course, our tough talk does not have billionaires tossing wads of cash at TV, radio and Internet networks to prop up crazy ideas for hours on end, nor does our tough talk insist on keeping ourselves armed to the teeth lest the jackbooted thugs of the government deprive us of our purity of essence. But, I'd rather be a hypocrite who isn't endorsing people being thrown in jail and shot than the one that is.

innocent bystander said...

the IOTW folk are birthers. this invalidates anything they have to say on any subject.

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